is Horizons beta closed until open beta or

[byte]

Just wondering if beta is closed until open beta or are they still adding people?

Reading about people trying to download about a 1 GB patch over dial up and I am sitting here with my High speed connection and I can't get in the beta. Just a Sad world.

I am so ready for Horisons, I cancelled all 3 of my EQ accounts with a character Flagged for the Plane of Time. I have my Hozions already pre ordered. From what I have read, I am ready to get into making my tradeskills starting on day one. But I would really love to try the beta before the Release day, so I can be comfortable with the controls and game play.

I know this has been half rant, half good. I just want in so bad, hehe.

[Xilimyth]

Welcome to the Boards byte. :) Glad to see I'm not the only one that's a "Bit" eccentric about Horizons (I know, bad computer pun).

Like with all people, I hope you get in. Just remember, Betas aren't demos :) If you do get in, file bugs, make Atari happy :).

*pats ya on the back*

[byte]

I know it isn't a demo and I want to be part of this new world and help find the bug. No matter how much care the programmers put in, with a project of this size there will be bugs.

[Xilimyth]

Good to hear. Best I can say to do is use the "Other" field in the application / profile to explain why you'd be a good tester. It gives the reader of the app more to go on I believe.

[Cesious]

I'm eccentric plenty... trust me... but on the topic of an app. reader... we should all tip our hats and cheer to the readers, I couldn't imagine sitting for endless hours reading the same thing over and over again. "I want in this beta so much, and if you let me in you won't regret it because I love this game! etc, etc, etc..."

[byte]

So are they still letting more people in the Beta 3? or closed until Open beta?

[Neocodeone]

Personnaly , I think that it is equally silly of peoples who got in the beta to just tell all the others than its stupid to feel rejected out of that beta . I think that cdkeys of the betas should expire after a user didnt use it for a while , because I read a lot on peoples getting in and never playing the game .
You're talking so much about beta testing and all the virtues that a beta tester should have , that you forgot the main point : a beta tester needs an interest to go on playing the game .
Personnaly , I dont mind not getting in , so long as when I play the game , I dont just get a bug in the quest I am trying to complete , or in the guild system , or a graphic bug . What sucks though is that a lot of peoples that got in the beta have just no interest in playing the game . But again , I am referring to "the game" as if this board was about Horizon . Mainly , that'ld because its what drove me here . I see a lot of potential in Horizon , but I am afraid that I might fail to live up to the hype ... That's not a problem though , since there is also EQ2 and WoW to come .

Though I dont know if they will be accepting any applications any longer , I would kinda feel sad if I had to wait until open beta, where my only contribution would be to help the server lag .

I could also say that the beta testing system is flawed in itself , it has a bug : some peoples NEVER get the opportunity to prove that they could truly help the developper , while those who get that opportunity dont even have to . I think that the beta tester themselves should be put to test . I guess that a "24 hour" beta testing "trial" could be a little hard to manage , but it could be the best solution , to both beta testing efficiency and board whinning (cause we sure see a lot of that) . Everyone wants to play the game so much ? Let them ! Give us a 24 hour period , if we find a bug , expand it to a week .. If not : "Thank you , good bye!" .
Why should we keep beta tester that have lost interest in the game (thus dont play the game and never report the bugs) . Even worse , why should we keep beta tester that fail to actually beta test the game and just use it for entertainement ... or that are just plainly too incompetent to find bugs . Some could argue that 24 hours just isnt enough , and that finding and correctly reporting a bug in that time frame is plainly luck ... Well , maybe it is , but if a beta tester is successful at beta testing the game , then I think he should be allowed to go on doing so .


On a final note , even though this was posted in a thread related to Horizon , and speaking mainly about horizon , this one of the avenue that betatests.net will have to explore if it truly wants to make beta testing something different ... Yes , the point system is a good idea , but everyones starts at 0 , and from that point , everything is about luck (should points be added for how long you've been subscribed to betatests.net ? should points be removed for failing to "test" a game ... those are all things you will have to consider) .

Thank you if you read until this final line , cause you sure got a lot of time :P . And please , can you try to get someone's attention to that post ? I really think that betatests.net needs to rethink the way you get inside the beta .

[Xilimyth]

Makes enough sense to me. I think I could actually "buy" the expiring CD Key issue. After all, those that aren't participating in the stress tests and BETAs even though they're in shouldn't take up space...

well, unless their computers exploded or something O_o

[Pyros]

Originally posted by Neocodeone
Personnaly , I think that it is equally silly of peoples who got in the beta to just tell all the others than its stupid to feel rejected out of that beta . I think that cdkeys of the betas should expire after a user didnt use it for a while , because I read a lot on peoples getting in and never playing the game .


While this is a good idea, it would create a lot of programming to do, and if the user is away when they recieve the email, it's slightly unfair for them to come back to a disabled account.

You're talking so much about beta testing and all the virtues that a beta tester should have , that you forgot the main point : a beta tester needs an interest to go on playing the game .
Personnaly , I dont mind not getting in , so long as when I play the game , I dont just get a bug in the quest I am trying to complete , or in the guild system , or a graphic bug . What sucks though is that a lot of peoples that got in the beta have just no interest in playing the game . But again , I am referring to "the game" as if this board was about Horizon . Mainly , that'ld because its what drove me here . I see a lot of potential in Horizon , but I am afraid that I might fail to live up to the hype ... That's not a problem though , since there is also EQ2 and WoW to come . .

The system is meant that users who are interested in the game sign up. But, no one has time to contact 10 000 applicants and ask them 5 questions about the game to see if they're really interested in the game. It's a system that has to relay on honesty, there is no other way.

Though I dont know if they will be accepting any applications any longer , I would kinda feel sad if I had to wait until open beta, where my only contribution would be to help the server lag .

They often pool by computer specs. While it's less random then pulling out of a hat, it can't accept everyone.

I could also say that the beta testing system is flawed in itself , it has a bug : some peoples NEVER get the opportunity to prove that they could truly help the developper , while those who get that opportunity dont even have to . I think that the beta tester themselves should be put to test . I guess that a "24 hour" beta testing "trial" could be a little hard to manage , but it could be the best solution , to both beta testing efficiency and board whinning (cause we sure see a lot of that) . Everyone wants to play the game so much ? Let them ! Give us a 24 hour period , if we find a bug , expand it to a week .. If not : "Thank you , good bye!" .

I've been betatesting a game (not saying which, NDA), and I haven't been able to log into a server for the 3 weeks I've been testing due to a known bug. I'm a dedicated tester, but how can I prove myself if I can't get on? It's not very fair to just cancel my account. Also, some bugs take time to find. You may not find a bug within 24 hours.

Why should we keep beta tester that have lost interest in the game (thus dont play the game and never report the bugs) . Even worse , why should we keep beta tester that fail to actually beta test the game and just use it for entertainement ... or that are just plainly too incompetent to find bugs . Some could argue that 24 hours just isnt enough , and that finding and correctly reporting a bug in that time frame is plainly luck ... Well , maybe it is , but if a beta tester is successful at beta testing the game , then I think he should be allowed to go on doing so .

Same thing here. Many dedicated testers don't find a bug within the first day of recieving a game. You're either going to have a server full of lucky people, or no people at all.

On a final note , even though this was posted in a thread related to Horizon , and speaking mainly about horizon , this one of the avenue that betatests.net will have to explore if it truly wants to make beta testing something different ... Yes , the point system is a good idea , but everyones starts at 0 , and from that point , everything is about luck (should points be added for how long you've been subscribed to betatests.net ? should points be removed for failing to "test" a game ... those are all things you will have to consider) .

They do start at 0. And you get points for finding bugs. If you're playing a game and not testing bugs, you're not getting points, and therefore hurting yourself.


Thank you if you read until this final line , cause you sure got a lot of time :P . And please , can you try to get someone's attention to that post ? I really think that betatests.net needs to rethink the way you get inside the beta .

Yes, I do.

[Neocodeone]

Thank you Pyros for correcting my mistake (that are mainly due to the fact that I am not really experienced at beta testing myself) . The 24 hour period , I must admit , does seem a little bit low .

I guess that a good solution to that would be not to limit to a 24 hours period to play the game , but to a 24 hour period of playing the game . Meaning that if I activate my account on 09/09/03@13:00 , the account doesnt go idle at 10/09/03@13:00 : it only does so if I have been playing for 24 hours :) .

This would also fix problems related to a server being down.

Also , the thing about the cdkey expiring doesnt require a lot of programming to do ... Mainly that could be just a simple database script ran weekly on all accounts . If a user plans to go away , he could also just lend his cdkey to one of his friend , thus allowing someone else to beta test the game ... Though the NDA might have something against that :) .

Now , when I say that peoples should have interest in the game , I am still refering to the fact that peoples who are not playing the game at all , shouldn't remain in the beta . Another way to fix all this would be to tell the users from the start that they have a "limited" beta-testing time , which will be extended through the finding of bugs ... That is already reflected by the different beta phases though .

I do not understand why it couldnt accept everyone ? Why give 1000 lucky peoples the chance to play and test a game for 4 months , when instead , 4000 could get it for a month ... Of course , there could be a problem with continuity . This is where the reward of finding bugs comes in :P .

And now , what I said about the point system , is that point shouldnt be awarded just when you find bug .. Cause if you NEVER EVER get in ANY betas , then you still stay at 0 ... Even though you've been waiting for a year , pending for several games (its not my case ... but still , it could've happened) .

Anyways , remember that this post is all about passive speculation ... I am just speculating as to how the system could be improved to make www.betatests.net something truly different that really offers loyal members and fans the opportunity to prove themselve , if not through testing , at least through time (if you get 1 more point each month of waiting , then your chances increases for each month that pass by... therefor , there are less chances that we see the good old "I got in after 2 weeks , but you've been there for a year and never got in", which I read so much about .) Also , about system spec ... well ... I guess it makes sense that system specs play a role in selection ... Got nothing to say there :) .

[Pyros]

Originally posted by Neocodeone

I do not understand why it couldnt accept everyone ? Why give 1000 lucky peoples the chance to play and test a game for 4 months , when instead , 4000 could get it for a month ... Of course , there could be a problem with continuity . This is where the reward of finding bugs comes in :P .

And now , what I said about the point system , is that point shouldnt be awarded just when you find bug .. Cause if you NEVER EVER get in ANY betas , then you still stay at 0 ... Even though you've been waiting for a year , pending for several games (its not my case ... but still , it could've happened) .

Anyways , remember that this post is all about passive speculation ... I am just speculating as to how the system could be improved to make www.betatests.net something truly different that really offers loyal members and fans the opportunity to prove themselve , if not through testing , at least through time (if you get 1 more point each month of waiting , then your chances increases for each month that pass by... therefor , there are less chances that we see the good old "I got in after 2 weeks , but you've been there for a year and never got in", which I read so much about .) Also , about system spec ... well ... I guess it makes sense that system specs play a role in selection ... Got nothing to say there :) .

First point: It's easier to have someone who's played for months to get familar with the game, so they can test with more ease, and locate bugs earlier. Also, their computers might be the specs they're looking for, while the others aren't.

Second: Let's say I have an idle account that I never used, but created a long time ago for the sake of having it. Let's say I have no interested in testing, I just want a free game. So, eventually, odds are I will get into a game, and I may never know it, or I will not find bugs or test, just play (note: this isn't me. Just a scenario).

edit: I've also suggested in the past a 40% experienced users(points), 60% new ones (signups) to fill up the beta pool.

[Lynch]

To me, the only reason to have Beta Testers is to find and fix bugs, and maybe to balance the economy and combat. But I also think a lot of players sign up for Beta tests just so they can get the one-up advantage on other players when the game spawns. (Actually, I know this for a fact.) It's human-nature of course, but I, personally, am far more interested in having a good RP expeirence, and nothing upsets that more quickly than random crashes to desktop or mad lag. So I guess my point is that Beta testers are in a position to either help or hinder everyone else's experience in the game.

It seems like any company who is producing a game would have some standards for communicating with Beta-testers...if nothing else, the Beta testers should have to comment frequently on the playability of the game.

I haven't Beta-tested for Atari before...maybe they do require this...but I know specifically of another game that really held their Beta-testers to no standards, and ended up from the spawn of the game with frequent CTDs and CTRs, and found themselves with an uncontrollable crop of exploiters (former Beta testers who were using code exploits) who really drove a lot of new players away from the game with their antics.

Even as we speak, the Devs for that game are struggling to stabilize the economy and angering most of their veteran players in the process. The community gets a little smaller every day. The game is spiralling down the virtual toilet, IMO. And the sad part is, it was mostly Beta-testers who started the ball rolling downhill.

[Neocodeone]

I cant see how a redisigning of the economy can anger "veterans" , since anyway that game DOESNT exist yet . It will exist soon , but a stable economy is something that need to exist , otherwise the game will just be too easy (imagine EverQuest if you could get your epic , or something better at level 10 ?).

I believe in dedication to making the game better , in making it so it WONT crash when it gets out , I also believe that some peoples dont apply to help , and I know for a fact that code exploit do exist ... But one thing that I dont believe in , is that someone will be a good beta tester if he has more interest in beta testing than it the game in itself (unless of course he can say , without a doubt , that he likes ALL video games to the point of INSTANT ADDICTION) . Maybe its just me , but I have real problems buying that "super-tester" image that comes out of nowhere with the specific goal of beta testing whatever game he sees (be it Pong v4.0) and make it better . I understand that not all part of a game is interesting to test (especially since beta testing is mainly trying everything to get a crash/exploit and eventually just trying to repeat that same crash again to get more information about it), but I wont buy Pong v4.0 ... Why would I make it better , I dont need it to be better , I dont even want it to exist . Maybe I am not as idealist about beta testing as you are , but I never truly believed in idealism , lets remember after all that there is no such thing , idealism is never but an excuse to give yourself an illusion of personality (Hesse , Nietzshe , Lacan , Freud all seems to concur on one point , do we truly have an unvarying ego ? an unvarying personnality , I truly doubt it) . Where am I goin with all that philo mumbo-jumbo ? Maybe its time to stop saying that there is so much about being a beta tester , when in fact , its all about clickin on a few buttons to get an account , then hope somedays , you will get inside one of the betas you actually WANT in .

Looking at it this way , the longer its been since you clicked those damn buttons , the more chance to get in you should have . Maybe points should be awarded for posting on the forum (and I am not talkin about 1pts/post , which would be stupid) . Somehow you seem to agree with change , but even the 40%/60% system , just makes it so that its always the same one that gets inside the beta and those that start at 0 still get the same problem . In the end , the only logical argument thus far on selection , is the system spec , since that is realisticly the only other place where they discriminate thus far .

How long you've registred ,
How active you are (forums posts)
How many tests you were involved with before

That's already 3 categories where I can see points given to someone ( the 2nd one acting as a counter argument to one of the point brought forth earlier about peoples who signed up a year ago and have no interest in it anymore ).

Yes .. yet another long post of dead ... get used to it , I kinda like those , and do remember that this just remains at the point of speculation , but you dont have to just give counter arguments ... it would be good to hear arguments to improve the system from someone else , instead of arguments about how my ideas are flawed ... I think it's already established that the system is flawed in itself .

Again , thank you for reading thus far , and dont be too harsh on me , I am well known for radical ideas , but that's how I am :) .

[r3b00t]

I've been waiting now for over a month, ok not that long but still I haven't been selected. If they would really select on system specs I think I would have a good change, not many people have a better system then me... specially on the time I registered. I have a P4 3 GHz with hyperthreading and a FSB of 800 MhZ, 2 x 512 MB Dual Channel DDR (800 MHz), Ati Radeon 9800 pro, ... I had the best computer on the moment I bought him :D Now there's already a 3.2 GHz CPU and a 256 MB version of the 9800 pro but still my system is heavy and currently I didn't got in to any of the 4 or 5 pc games I applied for. I'll think that the time you wait is also important and maybe it's stil some random but with my system specs I think I would have been selected already for something if they really needed people with high specs. Or maybe they just want low specs to test what happens on those computers :D

[Neocodeone]

.. It's not about how good your system is ... its about how many peoples are currently testing the game on these specific specs ...