DM-Getherto final beta

[virgo47]

Name: DM-Getherto
Version: Now in final...
See: http://www.ataricommunity.com/forums...d.php?t=518041

DM-Getherto is "green industrial". Should be best for 2on2, maybe 4on4. Duels are possible (map is not as big as it seems, something like shrinked on Rankin - longer, narrower), but this is not typical duel map because of power-up placement.

Description:
When Liandri corporation opened 'JAR-34' arena (Just Another Rankin - 34th industrial in its possession), no one could expect that players would name the arena on their own. Liandri chose an interesting man to make an arena keeper. Merty Getherto, former gardener and sprayer, surely imprinted his individuality to the face of the arena. Nobody calls it by other name but 'The Getherto'. And he is also funny guy, really. Even Malcolm likes talking with him for a few minutes before he enters another match to win.


Super shield room.


Super shield room one more time.


Central area where Merty's friends show their art.


On your walk from LG to a50 you can take a look at some graffity.


Lower part of the Central area (rocket, health, just you and the action is missing ;-)).


DD room alias Cooling Courtyard.


Upper level of the DD courtyard.


Bio Passage room.

Thanks/credits:
- Hourences for some HourIndusX textures and some static meshes from Redkin (in addition to retail levels ;-))
- Fan klan 47 and other players from Slovak community that helped me with suggestions
- www.aerosolart.sk for some images placed on "sprayed wall"
- Miramar skybox by Jockum Skoglund aka hipshot (I just changed brightness and contrast for night effect)
- I used some textures by Chavez (chavitex pack)
- Special thanks for feedback goes to: Sjosz, evil<3 and Turret49
- Another people that helped the map to be better: Turns2Ashes, CMan, Angel Mapper
- Thanks for technical help (forums, tutorials): Hourences, Angel Mapper, Hazel.H, Sjosz, evil<3
- JP-Studios inspired me to bring gardener into the story
- Unreal Exploiters
- Any other author of any retail material

[JP-Studios]

Ok 1st off I love the foliage you have here, however you should have The Vines also climbing the adjecent walls to keep it consistant. Unless you leave a gardener's bench somewhere to show that the ivy's being kept trimmed and The Overall layout of the design is well structured even if you did duplicate some things from the rankin map. But where the holes are in the walls? Could leave a bit residual broken bricks and maybe a lil pile of cement dust scattered abit around the hole areas? Otherwise its a great looking map and should be a really hoot to frag in.

[virgo47]

Thanks... maybe the vines are trimmed by some "arena keeper", but deco is not final at all ;-)... I put vine only where I tried something (e.g. "how it will be when you can fire thru this vine but you don't see enemy so good", etc). Bricks, everything - I've got it on my mind. :-))) This is second iteration of layout based on some suggestions by my friends from Slovak community and now I'm trying to get some other from the world. :-)

You're words will not be forgotten. :-)

[JP-Studios]

Might I make a suggestion of having one or two Airducts to crawl thru and maybe even have them meet in the middle at some point? Figure that chaos it could cause.

[Mr. uglyPants]

i like the doorway in the middle of the last picture very cool!

[DCD_123]

I have no particular problem with the "rankin" theme, but some people do. So, I suggest downloading and using Hourence's HourIndusX texture package- it may be big but it is worth it. The textures in it are rankinish somewhat, and so you could use them to make your map look individual, without breaking the theme. Otherwise, looks good. the foliage is an original touch

[virgo47]

DCD: I've got the pack already and I'm planning to use those textures. I like how DM-Crampage looks different because of those textures. You're making me even more decided to use them. There will be combination of indusX textures and Rankin brick... I'm definitely not going to rework that hole Mr. uglyPants likes (and it is based on Rankin brickwall). :-)

I really don't know why I tried put some Ironic things into it (foliage) but it works somehow. :-)

[DCD_123]

good man.

[CMan]

Hmm, well. Here are my thoughts:

Ok, so I like the layout of the 100a room, but I think it needs some tweaking. First, I really don't like that corner by the flak cannon. It seems like its a death-trap to try to get up there. If you want to change it, I would recomend perhaps a jump-pad, or keep reading

I don't like the idea that im liftjumping to get a bit of ammo and thats all. It does put you in a high vanatage point, but its a double-edged blade, you are very vulnerable there, so I would think few would go up there for any reason.

Now, I would like to see something like continuing the duct from the lift-jump-area over across to the corner I mentioned above, It would provide another way up there, another exit, and make some extra use of the flak corner that could be beneficial in such an exposing spot. With this change I would also move the 100a up to the top area, making it harder to get and more exposed.

Both areas that contain the Link gun seem to be out-of-place or I just don't like them. The one room with the ramp seems out of the way, and likley not to be used, unless you require a link gun. Consider removing this whole room. The other spot in the tight hall seems, well tight. It also doesn't seem like a good spot for a weapon, much less the linkgun.

The shock room / dd room is nice, but also needs something. The hall from the cramped linkgun seems to tight for practical use, but its feasable. The location of the shock rifle itself seems ok, and the DD presents a nice pickup, but might be to near that lift. Perhaps think about swaping the DD and the shock, I just picture people getting the DD while being chased and then lift jumping to saftey... Also try to do something with that small ledge, maybe a 50a or adren or something.

The rocket location doesn't seem to fit for me... You have like 6-7 ways into that area, I don't think it should hold the R/L. With that being said, I also don't like where the LG is. It doesn't suit it.. Perhaps consider swaping the RL and LG.

Also, on the large ramp, I would like to see something for that short duct through the wall, perhaps a short ledge to where the RL is, or a dodge ramp like the oposite side of the ramp has.

Now, the flak room seems bare. You need to encourage action on the bottom level (especially if you move the 100a). I would recomend putting a LinkGun down there, and maybe some other pickups.

Other than that, I like it, I love the vines. I only ran through quick, so I might have missed some things, or not had a clear picture on the whole scheme of things, but I think I was close.

[virgo47]

Ah, thanks for comment - for first. I have something to think about - and you know... I always somewhat disagree first ("ruining the hole idea :-)"), but then it starts to come ("oh, he was (partialy) right about it"). I know it from last month. :-) With that said, let's take a look at your points.

I have always some idea when I put something somewhere - it may be bad one, of course. I choose "a100 in dead end" and "DD in a place with many entrances". There are many other kinds of risk - of course, so far I'll stick with this configuration - but I can move them later (as I did it in past).

Flak corner is fast way to go up and risky one. I'll think about jumppad. Lift jump is kinda Rankin heritage and there are more things upthere than in Rankin. :-) And in team games, someone can like this position while guarding a100. I like the idea of another way out but I did not want more narrow paths in the level (I did it on the last map) - and there is no place for a wide one. :-)

a100 down there is much more exposed (you can now even snipe it from 4000uu - see third picture - although sniper's time window is narrow) - it is exposed for attacks from both levels. Now - as I write - I think about a100 on the place of the health pack near flak. The platform from flak with the health is newer one (than a100 placement).

Link room with ramps... history: there was a hallway from lift's down exit to the central area (like upper level). I broke it because I did not want so many places with long line of sight (and quite wide). Then room came. ;-) It is go-thru room and respawn spot. Later then a hole opposite to the a100 was added - because both lower entrances to a100 were to far from each other and I needed faster connectivity (for a chasing situation). With that hole, the room can go - theoreticaly. When it comes to linkgun - I'm not happy with location - I will deal with them later.

DD and shock. Again - I prefer power-up down. When room was laid out, it reminded me Campgrounds DD room. :-))) I think it is much safer to be near shock than to be near DD.

Rocket and LG... old topic. :-) When I placed them, central area was TOO open to let LG on the typical snipers positon. Now I think that LG can be moved. I have to admit that I placed flak and rocket on the higher level on purpose, but maybe it will hurt gameplay. If so, I will move them - probably more down somewhere.

Ledge near duct... ok, that's in plan now. :-) It was, but I forgot it. :-)

Flak room - of course if a100 will be up, flak will be... somewhere else. Link was originaly down, but it was moved to that "bad room". :-) I will talk about it with my "test team" (mates ;-)).

I don't think that you miss something, but of course - we have other "intentions". But I as a (starting) mapper may be wrong - mainly when I speculate too much sometimes. Thanks for all those things. No promises, except... I will think about it. :-)

[CMan]

Good to see your thinking about it / have thought about some already. Though it seems I might not have been clear about the 100a. I was thinking put it up to where you have to lift jump up there for it

The lift jump in rakin provides a nice bit of cover for an emergency, but its mostly out of the way and only used in specific cases. Your area could be used for so much more

[eviL<3]

Hi, havn't tested anything for a while, i thought i'd give it a go. Havn't tested much for bugs, and didn't find any missing blocking volumes. Very niceley blocked off!

This is too dark:


No Comment, let the pic speak for itself:


The top of this might need a blocking voume:


Some Texture misalignments:

[DCD_123]

I only realised today that there was even a lift in Rankin ... but I don't play that map much.

Anyway, It's good to see you thinking about things. Flow is far more important then asthetics, IMO.

EDIT: about the texture misalignments, I find that in Rankin- style industrial environments it is very easy and efficient to select all surfaces then use planar alignment to get them all matching up. Saves a lot of time.

[virgo47]

DCD - yeah, I'm doing it just that way. I just did not on some places yet. Mainly because I will choose some textures later. Bricks everywhere... ok, but not the same. ;-)

CMan: a100 upper than up - oh, I misunderstood you first time. :-) And Rankin, yes, it is not used often.

Evil: I know what you are capable of - reading the forum... but not now, please. :-) Map is not deserving it now. :-) I said "ignore textures", lightning too; fanklan logo will not be there neither (I just put it there for later on zoneportal texture). Just about liftjump... why blockingvolume? There is solid "brush" stop. I have no problem with player to get there or jump up on the vent-entrance mesh if he wants. :-) Still nice you care, because you are one of those I'd like to test the map... let's say in beta. :-)

PS: Textures was not applied properly, brushes in curved passage was just copied and vertex edited. ;-)

[eviL<3]

Sure. It's just that i'm used to beta testing more than alpha... I might give it another try looking at the layout. LOL, i just wasted my time... but it was fun. I'll test it in beta stage if i find time

[virgo47]

Sorry for the waste... I'm a starting mapper, but such magnitude of misalignments is really not my style. :-) I will appreciate beta test - sure about it.

And: In fact, I really don't know where alpha ends and beta should start. ;-) But it's layout test. But I'm not able to do "just layout now" and "lightning at the end", because I'm enjoying the mapping pretty much right now. (With all beginners pain of course. ;-))

[213]

Sorry but the DL link at the top of the page seems to be dead asdisc. I'd like to take this for a test run too. darnit

looks nice tho judging from the piccys.

[virgo47]

Uh, sorry, too much deletes in my tmp directory. It's up again. I'll be more carreful for current versions. :-)

[virgo47]

Super shield room.

Other two images in the first post (first post is always up to date :-)).

OK - weapon placement was changed. Rocket is down, mini is instead of it, and LG is instead of mini. Links and bio are changed too. Many textures are closer to finish, many meshes came up to the scene. :-) And a100 room is getting its final look&feel.

Check the description, gardener Marty Getherto appeared on the scene. ;-) Maybe he overdid it with the tree gate in DD room (and the leafs have collisions, this will be changed, of course!), but... you know. I'm doing experiments on human beings - on you! :-) And zones are not named, so respawns are really weird currently. :-)

Just please, don't take care of misaligned textures... still not in "fully textured" shape. :-)

I'm taking a week of vacation, net accessible, but no Unreal Editor (I hope, I'll get thru this crisis :-)).

[DCD_123]

Don't worry, we'lll be here to console you.

[Sjosz]

Try and alternate some more with floor textures to break up monotomy. Add a serious amount of trim to the map so it looks that much more clean. The trim can simply be based on a Base style texture, much like the LG to Mini route through the Flak room in Rankin. It will make the map look much cleaner.
Also, go nuts with foliage. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work, but I'd seriously give it a try, as the extra foliage can set your map apart from it's rolemodels or other maps with a similar theme.
Also, coloured lighting! Use a few sources with a cool blue or warm orange, right now the lighting looks kind of monotone. Subtle use is key though, so no extreme oversaturated stuff.
Loose bricks and tiles, broken bricks and tiles, terrain protruding in areas, tree/plant roots breaking through walls/floors/ceilings, loads of foliage, possibly roots/foliage winding around pillars/supports, all of this could really add to the map.
I hope this helps a bit, good luck finishing up!

[virgo47]

Sjosz, thank you very much for a comment and I'm really like, that I'm planning to do nearly exactly what you're suggesting. :-) Look up at the picture of super shield room, that is the lightning like it will be. In central area, I started with blue lights also (in a100 there is blue only thru ceiling windows). Let's face the truth, I'm learning mainly from Rankin/Redkin now, but I want to refresh the theme with foliage. Of course, floor texture will be different in DD room... just later. :-) Thanks for loosing bricks tip, I used "holes" in brick walls in central area, but single brick here and there will be fine too, I will do it. :-) Full scale triming is expected in beta stage.

Lightning in the room on picture you chose is only temporary. But I'm happy that I'm identified with you suggestions completly! :-)

[Sjosz]

Originally Posted by virgo47

Sjosz, thank you very much for a comment and I'm really like, that I'm planning to do nearly exactly what you're suggesting. :-) Look up at the picture of super shield room, that is the lightning like it will be. In central area, I started with blue lights also (in a100 there is blue only thru ceiling windows). Let's face the truth, I'm learning mainly from Rankin/Redkin now, but I want to refresh the theme with foliage. Of course, floor texture will be different in DD room... just later. :-) Thanks for loosing bricks tip, I used "holes" in brick walls in central area, but single brick here and there will be fine too, I will do it. :-) Full scale triming is expected in beta stage.

Lightning in the room on picture you chose is only temporary. But I'm happy that I'm identified with you suggestions completly! :-)

Well, you posted in Beta section, so I thought this was supposed to be BETA
Anyways, glad you agree.

[virgo47]

No temporary lights, no temporary textures (maybe ugly ones however ;-)). We're shifting into beta stage!

You can find images in first post... here only one of them:


DD area viewed from central area.

After a week of skiing I'm back and after two days of hard work, something like beta is here. ;-) Your suggestions are still welcome. Bots can take their bearings nicely I think. ;-) Zoning, antiportals, everything is there. Now I'm working on some deco-touches and debugging the map. Sounds are on my todo too... but later.

[DCD_123]

This looks very nice now . The map description is class . Downloading...

[virgo47]

Getherto already showed himself as an gardener, and now he adds some aerosol writings (both pictures from beta2 which will be available later). I'll add some real graffity later maybe.


Ok, this is not Getherto's work... it's Malcolm's obviously. ;-)


Bad bad little herb running over his name! :-) (Don't ask me why there is a flaw on this screenshot, it is not in the game, but I could not get any screenshot of this wall without similar flaw at the top.)

[cUnNiNg_StUnTs]

Nice fun little map, the only thing that doesn't quite seem right is the half wall made out of vines that you can not see through. I would have rather had some Rankin style Windows in there.

To me the foliage is nice but almost over powers the theme. The rest of the theme looks nice.

Another odd part is the really thin wall coming away from the super shield location to the left a thin wall with an opening? I'm OK with the opening but the thin wall makes it look like it was made as a last min. change or something.

PS get rid of the Alpha3 link halfway through the thread.

[virgo47]

Do you think "half wall" under the ceilings (2x) in a100 room or the one near DD (fourth picture in first post)? I know that the last one is insidious (mainly with bots that can see thru everything ;-)) and if it should kill gameplay, I'll change it somehow.

Foliage can overpower one map from time to time, mainly with such a description (ok, I admit, idea was first, description later). :-) But I get rid of one foliage smesh completly and no other "go away from my way, plant!" will be added. Wall decos (square foliage) is exception, some of it will be added.

That thiner wall - well, there are more walls in a100 and central area that should look, like they were added - all have that clean Rankin texture in contrast to room's own one. You can assume that these partition walls were added to break the space both in map, and in its world too. ;-) That's why they are different. If this one is too thin, I can fix it.

Old link was removed, thank you. I'm keeping first post up to date and forget about posts in the middle.

Summary: I want nice map, I want to learn something (second one, first one looking properly :-)) and I want good gameplay. The last one is important for me, so if something (plant or whatever) should break it, I want to know and fix it. Although everything - even gameplay - is too opinion based. :-) More opinions, more balance. Thanks for your one.

Now I'm working on DD room, because with open ceiling I made a rod for my own back. ;-) I have to add some clouds or whatever to make it looks less... sterile. ;-) (I never look at the skybox, but you know, everyone else is doing it. ;-))

[Angel_Mapper]

2nd pic in your first post: You should lower the lightmap value on those wood surfaces to get some sharper shadows on the floor.

[virgo47]

Thanks for reminding me... I read your tutorial about this (you know, that with Ironic examples) not so long ago... And now my problem - map already has 26 mega (beta1 a little bit less) - and I don't know what to do with that. ;-) No lightmap is less than 32 so far. Is it foliage? What I can do to clean it a little more then just culling the textures? I'm not happy that my map will be soon bigger than Redkin even without flying spitfires. :-))) I heard that bot path net also have some impact, maybe I drop some path shortcuts in places where it saves only few "meters" (but when I'm spectating, they like to use even marginal paths sometimes). Map is fast, no problem with FPS, but the loading size is not nice.